About bugs

nuaru · 12.10.2012

1) Errors 1-4 are pretty strange. Looks like a logic error in project. It's needed to be checked anyway. Please create thread for each error (if they are not already presented). Maybe someone who deal with them will reply and add more information.

2) ZennoPoster evolves like it should. There's no need to speak for all users. More than a thousand clients use ZennoPoster every day. I do not see their agreement with you.

3) Rostonix is a part of our support team and he knows answers to almost every question. If he does not know the answer, he calls me or other developers, and a minute later he already knows the answer.

4) I can not speak for darkdiver, but I haven't received any emails from you for a long time. Moreover, we have never said that we promise direct support from developers. There's no need to write directly to us. If we have questions, we will contact you . If I will constantly talk to at least ten of clients, I will not have time to develop the program. That's why we have support team. To collect and sort the questions and save developers' time.

5) In general, your post looks offensive to me. I see the obvious disrespect to developers, the word "crapdate" speaks for itself.

Kepperbes · 13.10.2012

nuaru сказал(а):
2) ZennoPoster evolves like it should. There's no need to speak for all users. More than a thousand clients use ZennoPoster every day. I do not see their agreement with you.

This I disagree with highly, and I know plenty of Zenno users who would agree with both DJ and I. Zennoposter has not been evolving, its been devolving. With every update, there are new bugs that hurt the functionality overall. Also, there are so many users of Zennoposter who dont participate in this forum, and judging by the way you've handled responding to customers here (for example, you threatened DJ), and then on the Warrior Forum you called one of your own customers a fat troll because he felt that Zennoposter was too buggy to be called an official release, so honestly I wouldnt blame people for not contacting you to complain. Every time someone complains either:

A) They get threatened
B) Get called a name
C) Have their post deleted/moved

I've told Anton before that alot more people would participate in the forums, and interact with the staff if the staff were more friendly to its customers, but to be honest, your not. Take this thread for example, DJ started it to complain. DJ has made videos to help promote Zennoposter, and has offered training for people when the Zenno team wasnt training anyone. A person who has done so much to support the software, gets treated like a nobody. This is the reason everyone wont speak up.

nuaru сказал(а):
3) Rostonix is a part of our support team and he knows answers to almost every question. If he does not know the answer, he calls me or other developers, and a minute later he already knows the answer.

I agree, Anton is usually on top of things, and responds as fast as he can. He doesnt know everything (never said that he did), and when he doesnt know, he always asks, so I have no complaints about Anton.

nuaru сказал(а):
4) I can not speak for darkdiver, but I haven't received any emails from you for a long time. Moreover, we have never said that we promise direct support from developers. There's no need to write directly to us. If we have questions, we will contact you . If I will constantly talk to at least ten of clients, I will not have time to develop the program. That's why we have support team. To collect and sort the questions and save developers' time.

This is another thing that is honestly just terrible. SENuke, Magic Submitter, Sick Submitter, SEO Link Robot, Article Marketing Robot, Document Marketing Robot, Market Samurai, Scrapebox, (другой софт), and almost every other popular platform gives support DIRECTLY from the developers to the customers. EVERY single one of them interact DIRECTLY with their customers, and they LISTEN to the feature requests that their customers make. Answering a few emails from your paying customers only takes a small amount of time. In fact i'd argue that it takes less time to respond to customers, than it does to post sales threads on other forums, and to call customers fat trolls. I like Zennoposter, but I honestly wish that the software developers would be alot more like the other software developers.

nuaru сказал(а):
5) In general, your post looks offensive to me. I see the obvious disrespect to developers, the word "crapdate" speaks for itself.

I didnt take DJ's post as being offensive. He, like me, uses Zennoposter on a daily basis, and he only wants Zennoposter to get better. Its hard however for the software to get better when every update has alot of bugs. Honestly, I dont even see a reason for having the enhancements forum, none of those requests really are going to be fulfilled, and there are some really good ones in there.

Hopefully you dont take this reply as offensive (and I made sure I kept it on topic), but this just an honest opinion, from an honest, paying customer.

Mankush · 13.10.2012

Guys, usually I`d keep my nose out of it. honestly. but this time I feel compelled to write my opinion.
I`ve been a user since ver 3. I see the software getting forward. In all aspects (for me anywayz). maybe I`m a low level user. maybe I just have more patience than the average jo. I love the program, I love the zenno community and am very proud to be part of it.

ok, lets start 1 by 1.

First of all, the guy who was called "fat troll" on the warrior forum was in fact one of the two:
1. Competitor trying to ruin the selling thread - in that case "fat troll" would be a compliment. I would call him a #$%@. did you actually see what he wrote? the language he used and the consistency he was doing that? on a SELLING thread? I would never hurt some one`s business.
2. User who is very upset with his purchase, does not like the software, and sorry for his purchase. in that case (and yes, it happens to me, too) - I offer a refund. it is better to "fire" a client than waste time and effort. that client was not supposed to be there in the first place.
My guess it was number 1.

Next - bugs.
Zenno team are not a huge company. we all know that. non of us thought they were 100 developers sitting in a big building, right? they make the best they can doing two things - offering more features and putting out fires on bugs. if they will just fix bugs - people will say they are not actually developing the program and nothing new happens and bla bla. if they just offer features then they dont fix bugs. to be honest - yes. there are bugs. just like any other software (I bought adobe production premium suit and it did not export hd properly - imagine that. ADOBE. ha?). But the big picture is that everything is going forward, not backward. for me - if I can create better bots than I was able in v3 - that says it all. and I`m not the smartest person on the planet.

Now, the real star of the thread. dex.
Ok. cant even think what I would do without your tutorials. most of the members of the community have a lot of respect for you. and on behalf of the zenno community I allow myself to say "thank you!" for all your videos. you are a very smart guy with a lot of knowledge but sometimes (and I have seen you do it) - you just KNOW you are right and dont choose your words before you shoot. think for a minute - if you were running a business - and operation like zenno - would you like this thread (even if it is true)...? I guess not. being polite has never killed anyone. even if you do know a lot and very smart (and in fact you do), there is no reason to let everything go. you say "you just had enough". I believe you. but after giving so much to the community you just give up? come on, we are waiting for new tutorials, dont let us down : )

Threatening - I - myself - did not get a phone call yet with some zenno team member saying "we will find you and kill you". so I really dont know what to say. yes, they are from Russia - the land of trees made out of pure vodka, but ,hey, they are geeki developers, not mobsters.

And last, but not least: zenno team. you have an amazing software. honestly. but - if you have such great user as dex, and you even put his videos on your formal help file\page - does it seem logic for you to let him down? obviously he is a very avid user to say the least. he cares so much that he actually takes the time to write and express that. how about you guys send him an email every now and then and invest some time to ask him what he thinks? and answer him via email? yes, you have a lot of clients, but non of them actually took the time to make full series of instructional videos (bigcajones too) - so collect all his email and just answer. simple.

Now, I have a meeting with a green friend named mary, peace out : )

slimdusty72 · 13.10.2012

I actually thought that Dex was part of the zenno support team, but I guess I was wrong!

His videos are featured on the zenno website and have been absolutely amazing. I am sure that just about everyone who is new to ZP will learn all the basics from his videos.

Everyone loves zenno, pretty passionately, and we all want it to develop well. I appreciate all the hard work of the developers, and in particular Anton who does a great job with customer support.

I do think, however, that for Dex to have posted this rather "inflammatory" post, he must have been pretty frustrated! I think, however, that of all of the community users, Dex should be offered a direct line to the developers - I think he would help to make zenno even more fantastic and work better.

Nuaru, rather than get offended, why don't you make the most of Dex's talent? He knows his stuff and is super helpful for the zenno community - a real asset.

hope you guys work it out :-)

nuaru · 13.10.2012

Thank you, Mankush!
"Russia - the land of trees made out of pure vodka" :-)

)))
In fact, it's not that bad))
Me personally never drank alcohol more than a sip of champagnein my entire life)

drvosjeca, Boxcutter, Kepperbes, user from WF (who is one of you, i truly believe) and a few others.
I've already spent a lot of time for talking with you.
I could spend this time for writing some new features for ZennoPoster.
You always post the same things.
If you have any problems or suggestions, please write about them in the appropriate sections.
Write about them and not about emotions that they have caused.

ZennoPoster is the best program in it's niche, much more powerful than other competitors.
If you do not think so, do not torture yourself.
Use the one which you think will fit you needs better.

drvosjeca, I talked with darkdiver, he did not respond to some of your messages, I'm sorry.We usually respond to all.
We were on vacations last week.
Secondly, he is very busy with developing right now.
Better write to rostonix, he will ask us and write you a respond.Since it will be verbally, it will take much less darkdiver's time.

Kepperbes · 13.10.2012

Mankush сказал(а):
Guys, usually I`d keep my nose out of it. honestly. but this time I feel compelled to write my opinion.
I`ve been a user since ver 3. I see the software getting forward. In all aspects (for me anywayz). maybe I`m a low level user. maybe I just have more patience than the average jo. I love the program, I love the zenno community and am very proud to be part of it.

I agree here, I love Zennoposter, there are some things that I dont love, but overall I enjoy the software.

Mankush сказал(а):
ok, lets start 1 by 1.

First of all, the guy who was called "fat troll" on the warrior forum was in fact one of the two:
1. Competitor trying to ruin the selling thread - in that case "fat troll" would be a compliment. I would call him a #$%@. did you actually see what he wrote? the language he used and the consistency he was doing that? on a SELLING thread? I would never hurt some one`s business.
2. User who is very upset with his purchase, does not like the software, and sorry for his purchase. in that case (and yes, it happens to me, too) - I offer a refund. it is better to "fire" a client than waste time and effort. that client was not supposed to be there in the first place.
My guess it was number 1.

Actually the "Fat Troll" was a guy who's pretty good with Zenno, who just felt like the software was being released waaay too early to be called the official release, and I, as well as several other members (including members in that thread) agreed with him. Zennoposter is alot less buggy than it was a couple months back, but DJ is right, we were pushed and told "Guys, everyone use Zennoposter 4 so that............................", and we did just that, used Zennoposter 4. However crucifying your customers for giving an honest opinion was not the best way to go about handling the situation.

Mankush сказал(а):
Next - bugs.
Zenno team are not a huge company. we all know that. non of us thought they were 100 developers sitting in a big building, right? they make the best they can doing two things - offering more features and putting out fires on bugs. if they will just fix bugs - people will say they are not actually developing the program and nothing new happens and bla bla. if they just offer features then they dont fix bugs. to be honest - yes. there are bugs. just like any other software (I bought adobe production premium suit and it did not export hd properly - imagine that. ADOBE. ha?). But the big picture is that everything is going forward, not backward. for me - if I can create better bots than I was able in v3 - that says it all. and I`m not the smartest person on the planet.

Well see, here's the thing. Out of all of those software platforms that I mentioned, there arent huge teams of developers. Take Scrapebox for instance. That was built and updated by a SINGLE person. There were no recurring fee's, and bug fixes were taken care of almost immediately. The majority of requests people made were filled, and that is why its hands down one of the best apps of its kind. Another example would be Article Marketing Robot. That used to be the go to software for contextual links, and that was developed by ONE person. Not a team of people, ONE person. SEO Link Robot, developed by ONE person, not a team of people, and there was a time where SEO Link Robot wasnt a recurring fee either. SENuke for quite some time didnt have a huge team of developers, and it was down to two people. Same with Magic Submitter, and The Best Spinner (which only gets paid recurring fee once per year). These are just some of the best tools that people are using (there are plenty more), and there isnt a big development team behind bug fixes and feature updates.

The main reason those platforms made so much money was because of customer support, bug fixes, and they gave their customers the features they requested. So the suggestions that I make, are based on what I've seen work and done time and time again by successful software developers. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, I want Zennoposter to blow the doors off of EVERYTHING else in the market! The thing is, the ONLY way that is ever going to happen is if the Zenno team decide to start listening to their customers, giving their customers what they are asking for (we are the ones paying for the software afterall), and getting on top of these bug fixes a little bit quicker. I give my hats off to Darkdiver for the things that he's done, and ESPECIALLY for this 4.3 update, I cant wait to get my hands on that, but please, PLEASE take into consideration more of what WE are asking for of Zennoposter, not what you guys feel it should be.

nuaru сказал(а):
Thank you, Mankush!
"Russia - the land of trees made out of pure vodka" )))
In fact, it's not that bad))
Me personally never drank alcohol more than a sip of champagnein my entire life)

Thats a shock, I thought Vodka ran from the water faucets over there in Russia, lol.

nuaru сказал(а):
drvosjeca, Boxcutter, Kepperbes, user from WF (who is one of you, i truly believe) and a few others.
I've already spent a lot of time for talking with you.
I could spend this time for writing some new features for ZennoPoster.
You always post the same things.
If you have any problems or suggestions, please write about them in the appropriate sections.
Write about them and not about emotions that they have caused.

Are you actually accusing me of being that WF user again? Given the fact that you call that WF client a fat troll and you now think it's one of us 3 your really just implying that we are all fat trolls since there is no exact finger that you can point the finger of blame to, which is disappointing. If you read between the lines, that WF thread had some really good advice in it by the people talking to you. Make Zennoposter kick butt by giving your customers what they need in order to get the job done. With that being said, I truly appreciate you taking the time out to hear the things that I, and my other comprades have had to say. I speak with emotion because unlike alot of the customers you mention, I actually CARE about Zennoposter. Im a regular, DAILY user. I sold off ALL of my other stuff to use Zennoposter 100%. Im not like alot of the other customers who buy it, use it a little bit, buy a template here or there, and then use other software instead. I ONLY use Zennoposter. Boxcutter, DJ, Bigcajones, and the rest of our group are pretty much all the same way. So when we speak, were speaking from the perspective who's combined experience could make Zennoposter a MONSTER. We end up repeating ourselves and saying the same things because sometimes it feels like there is no effort being made to give your supporting customers the kind of features they ask for. Just look at that enhancements forum, there are some SUPER great ideas in there that would make Zennoposter function on a level that NOTHING else could compete with. I know some things are more difficult to code than others, but even a little bit of attention to that could go a LONG way.

nuaru сказал(а):
ZennoPoster is the best program in it's niche, much more powerful than other competitors.
If you do not think so, do not torture yourself.
Use the one which you think will fit you needs better.

I agree that Zennoposter is the best program in its Niche for now, and my goal is to keep it that way.

gemini · 13.10.2012

I'm zenno user for a while.
As every software it has pros and cons. ZennoMP compared to Zenno3, brings up a lot new features and improvements but also brings back lots of limitations AND bugs. Is trying to enforce new way of working on users which is more friendly to non programmers but is real pain to more advanced users. E.g. such tedious task as reading file from template current directory seems to be not possible (or i haven't found a way to do it, writing to custom file is ok, but reading doesn't work - I guess zp4 reads file at template start while variable is set later).

Additionally devs are adding lots of features not as much usable/or needed - at least for me (like intelllisearch, scraping,context,ftp etc) wasting resources on them. It's hard to blame them for that, they are trying get more competitive against other softwares.
But still I think they should put most work on core features. They did amazing job rewriting project maker interface - compared to zp3 it simply pleasent to work with unfortunately they changed the way program works killing old macroses and new way is less flexible IMO. Devs tried to do revolution with ZP4 while evolution is usually safer, and takes far less resources.

drvosjeca сказал(а):
Yeah i know you are trying, but i dont know how can one thing work fine at some point, and when next update is released... it is not working anymore...?!

Well it's... normal, unfortunately. Such complex softwares with many dependencies interacting with each other is simply impossible to test every possible system configuration and usage scenario. Even Microsoft (having much more resources) got such problems that one update breakes something else.

gemini · 13.10.2012

drvosjeca сказал(а):
c) "ZennoPoster is the best program in it's niche"... Let me just tell you that this is far from truth! There are other tools which can do a lot more, but they also cost more. Im curently runing 30 days trial of tool which costs almoast 2000$, and im planing on buying it in 2 months time. This tool can automate browsers, desktop and even mobile phones (after you record your actions, you just compile and send it as app to android or iOs phone)...

That sound interesting. Could you please share the name of the program on PM?

goldsilver · 13.10.2012

Think about positive side, we have so many users who care about ZP.

You need to know that i get skype contact requests all the time, and people ask me how to do this, and how to do that... and i dont send them away saying things like "contact zenno support"

Yeah i ask alot of questions when i start. THANKS.
Since you are not zenno suport, man, I owe you a favor.

Boxcutter · 13.10.2012

As much as I didn't want get involved with this thread it looks like I have to now. Nuaru since you have
made a direct accusation that the infamous fat troll or should I say client from the WF thread is either myself, DJ or
Kepperbes and both of them have reiterated that it's not them I too have to waste my time to tell you once more that
I'm not him either.

I PM'd you months ago explicitly telling you that I wasn't him when you were first posting about the WF feedback/trolling
on one of my bug threads and you apologized for the misunderstanding but now you have decided to pop up here
with a healthy dose of paranoia pointing the finger at me (and the other two) again.

I don't take kindly to off the wall accusations/insults so just end this BS here.

loveforfire33 · 13.10.2012

im not going to get involved here too much. i personally think ZP4 is getting better... BUT its still the most buggy software i have ever purchased. and ive purchased alot.

My suggestion. Stop adding obscure features that no one really uses (i mean context recognizer... come on.. really?), and just spend a few months getting your bugs sorted. I know you want to make it look like ZP4 has loads of bells and whistles to get more customers... But think about this....

At the moment i personally would not recommend ZP to anyone, and im sure other people think the same. Its far too buggy (it took a month to get it even working on my machine, it still wont work on my dedicated bot machine). There seems to be no testing process for your releases, when you fix something you break other things and miss them - regularly. HOWEVER, if you sorted the bugs i would LOVE ZP and recommend it to everyone. Its awesome and has so much potential.

But If your not careful ZP is going to start getting a really bad reputation. Which is corporate suicide in the IM world.

We all see the potential in ZP here and want to help you make it awesome.

sMax · 13.10.2012

It seems to have been a "rough ride" for many users and developers. I hope that gets better soon.

I want to contribute three things to this thread.

1 @nuaru: for me, the killer feature for zennoposter would be a duplication of pm and poster for windows automation that seamlessly interfaces so you can do the whole prepping in windows and submittal in the browser. If you can do this while only doubling the price, I think you have a BIG winner. Having batch files might also do the job, but then you need 2nd and 3rd software, which is less elegant and more cumbersome.

2. @all: I still think zennoposter is the best in its class(feature and price-wise). I can't honestly compare it to software that has an entry price of 6x ($2000) the price I paid for ZP PRO for a single license and at least $4500 for 'floating' licenses and only goes on up from there. ( I can't compare scrapebox to zennoposter either! but both are useful)

3. @ Zenno Team: The single thing I miss the most is a well written reference guide. Videos are nice to show processing, but the main features and what a button or field does needs to be documented in a reference guide. What we have now is insufficient. Everything needs to be tried out before implementing to see how it really works.
And not having a reference guide means every feature is in flux and non defined, this leads to uncertainty and frustration for users.

Keep up the good work everyone. :-)

nuaru · 13.10.2012

To make problem of this topic looks clearer, you need to take the Kepperbes' message and replace the word "client" with "we" (Kepperbes and co) and puzzle will be solved.

Don't we support the program? Obviously we do.
Don't we fix bugs? Of course we do. You can look at bugs section and changelog.
Don't we listen to our customers? Certainly we do. Most features in ZennoPoster from v.1 were created after requests from customers.
So what's the problem?
It's simple.

Kepperbes and co,
ZennoPoster is not created for you personally. Me, darkdiver and other members of the team do not work exclusively for you. Your bug reports are not solved in the first place. We do not stop current working process and start to develop your personal requests. It will never be this way.

You are one of the many customers and we are busy working for all our clients, not just for you.
Do not constantly claim a special relationship, special attention.
And, please, stop the hypocrisy, stop using the word "clients" and "customers" and, finally, begin to write honestly "we".

And once again I ask you, please, stop wasting my time on useless talk.

Mike Anthony · 13.10.2012

The problem in business (and especially in the software business) is even if you have things no one else has there is always another company to come around in a month or two or even a year or two that will provide it. I read threads like this and think okay temporary problem that can be fixed there is still a future with this . Then I read Nauru tell the one person that has given me any real training material worth a lick, really the only reason I even bothered to try MP that he doesn't need to take emails from him but if he has questions he'll send them to DV and I think Sheeesh this isn't a programming problem that can be fixed easily. It goes far deeper and makes users think that because of attitudes some things will never be fixed. So I am at the point of using ZP and liking it but being very shaky on its future

and love for fire I hear you man...the thing about buggy software and lack of training materials (in English except for DV) is that you never know where the fault is. I spent weeks thinking it was something I was doing wrong with Zennoposter. I tried it on two different machines and it just wouldn't work. Got another VPS the other day and said hey lets see. All of a sudden I knew it wasn't my template that wasn't working cause it flew but then you never know. I had one template that worked on my home system and then stopped working no reason. So now everything is on my VPS.

Kepperbes · 13.10.2012

nuaru сказал(а):
To make problem of this topic looks clearer, you need to take the Kepperbes' message and replace the word "client" with "we" (Kepperbes and co) and puzzle will be solved.

Don't we support the program? Obviously we do.
Don't we fix bugs? Of course we do. You can look at bugs section and changelog.
Don't we listen to our customers? Certainly we do. Most features in ZennoPoster from v.1 were created after requests from customers.
So what's the problem?
It's simple.

Kepperbes and co,
ZennoPoster is not created for you personally. Me, darkdiver and other members of the team do not work exclusively for you. Your bug reports are not solved in the first place. We do not stop current working process and start to develop your personal requests. It will never be this way.

You are one of the many customers and we are busy working for all our clients, not just for you.
Do not constantly claim a special relationship, special attention.
And, please, stop the hypocrisy, stop using the word "clients" and "customers" and, finally, begin to write honestly "we".

And once again I ask you, please, stop wasting my time on useless talk.

At this point Nuaru to be honest with you, reading this response I am not surprised by your tone in the least bit. I would like to say that I dont represent your entire customer base, but I speak with a large majority of your English speaking customers, and i've helped them in the past when there was no instruction on Zennoposter what so ever. Regarding this "Kepperbes and Co", I would like to point out that all I ever do on this board is three things:

1) Help other users out who are asking questions about the software
2) Notify the staff of bugs
3) Make feature requests in the enhancements forum

Now lets focus a bit on points 2 and 3 for a moment. Is it my fault that every single bug that Zennoposter experiences I have to post to notify the staff that there is a bug? No, that is not my fault. It is my job to make sure the staff knows that there is a bug that needs to be fixed in order for Zennoposter to work properly, which in all honesty there have been so many bug reports that I've stopped counting them. Now with point #3, if we were to count the number of threads with feature requests that I personally created, you can see that the majority of feature requests are coming from OTHER PEOPLE.. All I do is agree to what I believe are great ideas, and speak up on how I feel this software should be better.

With that being said, I would like to focus on this bit right here where you said:

nuaru сказал(а):
Don't we listen to our customers? Certainly we do. Most features in ZennoPoster from v.1 were created after requests from customers.

Based on this response would it be safe to assume that you havent really added features based on customer requests? According to what you wrote above, the version that had the most feature requests based on customers was from Version 1, and we are now on Version 4, BEGGING the staff to listen to US the CUSTOMERS (or as you would say "Kepperbes and Co").

With the above being the case, if you honestly feel that you are TRULY giving your customers software that has more workable features than it does bugs, and if you TRULY feel that you are giving your customers something that will help everyone as a whole, then I'd like to openly challenge you on it. Put it to a vote. Give your customers the opportunity to vote on whether or not they agree, or disagree with whats being said in this thread. If the customers agree, then PLEASE give us back the Zennolab team from Version 1, who were hungry to provide the people with hands down the absolute BEST software money could buy, and give us the features that are being requested. If the customers disagree, you've got my word that I will never open my mouth to say a single negative thing about Zennoposter EVER, ANYWHERE. Im not hard to find, my screen name is Kepperbes on all of the forums that I use, so I can promise that I'll keep my word.

Are you up for the challenge?

Kepperbes · 14.10.2012

Im going to assume that since this thread was moved, the challenge has been declined ;-)

.

Здраво · 14.10.2012

Basically what I want to know when we'll get ability to edit the template while debugging it, a feature we all want and its promised to us couple month ago! here

JackedUp · 14.10.2012

Здраво сказал(а):
Basically what I want to know when we'll get ability to edit the template while debugging it, a feature we all want and its promised to us couple month ago! here

Yes!!! THIS!!!

This would be the #1 BEST feature you could add in addition to fixing current bugs (I agree with the others that there are many bugs).

Everything else is low priority in my opinion.

Thank you.

Kepperbes · 14.10.2012

Looks like "Kepperbes and Co" are beginning to speak up Nuaru. Still think its just me speaking for everyone?

loveforfire33 · 15.10.2012

"kepperbes and co".. How unbelievably arrogant of you nuaru.

Ill say it again. I have faith in ZP, and i think it is improving with each update. Even if its improving slowly. Luckily you have EXCELLENT customer support from rostonix, without him ZP would be useless for many new users. Id still be thinking i was doing something wrong, when infact its usually a bug.

Kepperbes · 15.10.2012

loveforfire33 сказал(а):
"kepperbes and co".. How unbelievably arrogant of you nuaru.

Ill say it again. I have faith in ZP, and i think it is improving with each update. Even if its improving slowly. Luckily you have EXCELLENT customer support from rostonix, without him ZP would be useless for many new users. Id still be thinking i was doing something wrong, when infact its usually a bug.

542 views, and still no response back from Nuaru since this thread was moved over to the "Off topic" section. Its interesting that more and more people are beginning to come and speak up in distaste of the behavior of Nuaru. I could only imagine how things would've turned out if he had actually taken me up on my challenge and put things to a vote and let the customers decide. He said "Kepperbes and Co", but clearly Nuaru you can see more and more people are speaking up, and its not just me. I'd bet my last dollar that if this thread wasnt moved to a forum that not many people read, MORE people would see it, and MORE people would respond, which leads me to believe that either you are in complete denial about what we are all telling you, or that you simply just do not care to listen to us. Which is it Nuaru?

Stereomike · 15.10.2012

I said it in the past, and I say it again (goes along the lines of Mike Anthony's post): The problem is not the software, the problem is communications.
Have you seen the thanks of that first post? How often are posts liked that much? How many of your 1000 customers are active on the forum? Of these active ones, how many have a deeper understanding of the software, so their able to see bugs that only occur in certain situations? Don't make the mistake and think, it's only a matter of a few uneccessary trolls.
In fact it's a matter of most englishspeaking expert users that I get to know around here. The ones that are active, that keep in touch with each other and do business every day.
Please don't let us down.

nuaru · 15.10.2012

Я могу потратить время на пустые разговоры с вами. Но только уже на своем языке. Так быстрее. А вы лучше поймете меня.

Have you seen the thanks of that first post?

Да.
Вы согласны с ошибками?
Вы запостили эти ошибки в раздел bugs?
Вы ставили "thanks" в этих топиках?
Здесь этого делать не нужно.
Вы согласны с ошибками или с настроением drvosjeca? Может создадите топик со словами "у меня прекрасное настроение" и будете ставить там "thanks".
Таким топикам место в offtop.

Вы хотите новых фич? Исправления багов? Я вас понимаю...
Но есть проблема.
Все вы хотите разных фич и мешают вам разные баги.

Странно ведет себя Kepperbes.
Ему не нужны какие-то конкретные фичи или багофиксы. Ему нужны все. И сразу.
"Вы должны создавать новые фичи!!!"
"Вы должны фиксить баги!!!"
Спасибо, капитан очевидность :-)

Kepperbes начал требовать скидок. А иначе у нас плохой маркетинг.
Это нормально? Может мне лизнуть его зад? Чтобы маркетинг был хороший? :-)

)

Stereomike · 15.10.2012

@Nuaru
You make a point there, obviously I (and others) weren't loud enough when some develoments became strange. I should have posted more here instead on closed groups. But I did support feature requests and complaints with my 'thanks' button. I know that, cause we talk to each other, and when I hear from a thread that gets me interested, I drop by and give my 'thanks'.
Anyway, my biggest issue doesn't relate to bugs or development speed.
Gemini put it like that:

gemini сказал(а):
As every software it has pros and cons. ZennoMP compared to Zenno3, brings up a lot new features and improvements but also brings back lots of limitations AND bugs. Is trying to enforce new way of working on users which is more friendly to non programmers but is real pain to more advanced users.

That's my biggest problem with v4. Instead of evolving v3, v4 is something totally different and aimed at ease of use instead of allowing very complex solutions.
Instead of broadening the capabilities, v4 introduces many workflow changes (and limits) that made me abstain from it.
But I understand, that it's worthless, when I start complaining on stuff that you and I can't change (you already choose to invest months of time into v4 the way it is, no way to turn back time). That's the reason why I am only rarely seen around here. Frustration.
And seeing how people get frustrated every day in my group over v4 problems does really concern me aswell. I know the shortcomings of v3 very good, I need to replace it, but for me v4 is not yet an option. At least not as long as i want to stay clear of heart attacks.

So what should I take from your post? You seem to ask, why we come out only when the shit hits the fan, and not in the regular feature requests and bug threads? As I can see it, there were plenty of bug reports (DJ even put videos out). The status quo is not enough? So we should be even louder, putting opinions more aggressive to the public?
I guess I got you wrong, you can't have asked for that.
So you got our feedback. It's up to you, if you decide to ignore it, or try to work with it.

nuaru · 15.10.2012

drvosjeca, вы поняли меня не правильно. Я говорил про Kepperbes :-)

Насчет ошибок.
Вы должны были заметить, что мы поменяли внутренности на Fireox 15. Это вызвало некоторые ошибки. Они будут исправлены, как всегда.
Я вижу вашу активность в этом топике. Но я не вижу вашу активность там, где нужно. В топике с багами.
Там я вижу lokiys. Спасибо lokiys!
Посмотрите на старые топики с багами. Они решены. Если вы хотите, чтобы ваши баги решились, пишите о них. Не здесь. В разделе багов.

Баги будут всегда. Если вы давно работаете с ZennoPoster, вы будите видить много багов. В отличие, от новичков.
ZennoPoster содержит очень много функций. Поэтому, в нем больше багов, чем в других SEO программах.

Вы думаете мы не работаем над багами?
Вы думаете мы не работаем над новыми фичами?
Работаем, конечно.
Мы можем править баги быстрее? Нет.
Мы можем писать новые фичи быстрее? Нет.

В чем проблема?

Kepperbes · 15.10.2012

nuaru сказал(а):
Я могу потратить время на пустые разговоры с вами. Но только уже на своем языке. Так быстрее. А вы лучше поймете меня.

Thats fine, If it gets you to respond to us quicker, you can right in chinese for all I care, just as long as you interact with your customers.

nuaru сказал(а):
Да.
Вы согласны с ошибками?
Вы запостили эти ошибки в раздел bugs?
Вы ставили "thanks" в этих топиках?
Здесь этого делать не нужно.
Вы согласны с ошибками или с настроением drvosjeca? Может создадите топик со словами "у меня прекрасное настроение" и будете ставить там "thanks".
Таким топикам место в offtop.

Nuaru, every single time one of my friends finds a bug, I test it to see if I'm experiencing the same problem (im friends with a good majority of the English users on this forum, and some of the Russian ones too). If I also experience the problem, then I will respond to the thread, say thanks, and do whatever is in my ability to make sure that the staff realizes that it is a bug, and not a glitch on one persons system. As far as threads being moved to the off topic forum, I honestly believe that this forum is meant for placing threads that you dont like, so nobody will see them. A good majority of the threads in the off topic section are threads (and posts) with people complaining some way or another about some aspect of Zennoposter that does not work, so people get frustrated with it, and write about it, especially considering that you labeled this the "official" release, and this has so many bugs that there is no way this should be the "Official" release.

nuaru сказал(а):
Вы хотите новых фич? Исправления багов? Я вас понимаю...
Но есть проблема.
Все вы хотите разных фич и мешают вам разные баги.

To be honest, yes, I want certain features that were not in Zennoposter 3, but I dont need all of the unnecessary extra stuff. For example, the new content module that was added. I, nor any other experienced SEO needs that because they already know what they are doing. There are other features that could've been given to us in place of that, because I know the majority of the customers have not requested that feature.

nuaru сказал(а):
Странно ведет себя Kepperbes.
Ему не нужны какие-то конкретные фичи или багофиксы. Ему нужны все. И сразу.
"Вы должны создавать новые фичи!!!"
"Вы должны фиксить баги!!!"
Спасибо, капитан очевидность

Well on the contrary, I have very specific things that i'd like, and i've been asking for them for a long time now. Just so that we are clear, here are IMO the most IMPORTANT features that Zenno needs:

Features:

1. Drag and Drop - We were promised to get this in Zennoposter 4, but here it is were on update 4.2.5.0, and we *STILL* dont have it.
2. Edit Template While In Debug - Another feature we were promised to get in Zennoposter 4, and Darkdiver said that he'd give it to us in 2-3 of the PREVIOUS updates. This is something that EVERYONE has been asking for since Zennoposter 3, and should have already been a part of Zennoposter 4, and is yet another reason why people are saying Zennoposter 4 was labeled as the "Official" release way too early.
3. Email - POP3 login and download all the activation links that match your regex so you can confirm them in one go. Something that we complained about in Zennoposter 3, and *STILL* dont have in Zennoposter 4. The way it is you can only get one activation link at a time so if you signup to multiple sites with the same email you will keep POP3ing the email account and get banned. The only workaround is to try and use muliple email accounts and hope they don't POP3 the same account too many times, and this is a BIG problem.
4. Macro Builder - I've been told that something similar to that will be in build 4.3, so I wont say anything about this until thats been released
5. Scheduler - PLEASE DO SOMETHING WITH THE SCHEDULER! Give us the ability to start templates when other templates stop. Give us back the ability to batch templates and group them like in Zennoposter 3.

As you can see, what I ask for is VERY minimal, and I only ask for things that naturally should have been in Zennoposter 4 as the Official release, it would've made Zennoposter 4 GREAT, and alot of us would'nt be complaining anywhere near as much as we do. I dont like complaining about this stuff no more than you like reading about it, so it would be in our best interest to work TOGETHER on this, then AGAINST one another. I use Zennoposter DAILY to help run (and automate) my business, which is why I get so frustrated by the way you act sometimes. Its like I said in my previous post, EVERY other software developer that I mentioned above interacts DIRECTLY with their customers, and do their best to provide them with what they ask for. They arent arrogant, they dont call their customers names, and they dont threaten their customers, you are the FIRST person I've EVER seen do that, and im 99% certain that the people watching this stuff use this to make a buying decision.

nuaru сказал(а):
Kepperbes начал требовать скидок. А иначе у нас плохой маркетинг.
Это нормально? Может мне лизнуть его зад? Чтобы маркетинг был хороший? )

Demanding discounts? Please lets give things a bit of perspective. First, Zennolab releases a product FILLED with bugs, and then tells all of its users to use Zennoposter 4 and work on it. So we all move over to Zennoposter 4, convert our templates, rebuild other templates, and then we can barely use them because of all the bugs. We spend MONTHS reporting the bugs that we've found, and help you guys develop the software so that its better. You even went and released it as an "Official" release, when all of us testers told you it was too early to make it official, but you did it anyway. Then not to long after that you have a "Birthday" sale that *ONLY* accommodates people new to Zennoposter, or people buying an additional license, but NOTHING for those of us who spent all that time in beta testing helping you fix and find things. Yes, I was the main person being vocal about it (as usual), but other people agreed. I wasnt demanding a discount, I was demanding some customer appreciation to the people who have been customers since Zennoposter 3, who were told to move to Zennoposter 4. Then as I complained, what did you guys tell us? "You can still use Zennoposter 3". So thats the response we get AFTER spending so much time in Zennoposter 4?!? This is the reason why the Zennoposter reputation is going down the drain, you still dont know how to treat your customers. Look at how Scrapebox treats their customers, and that'll be a good example.

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